NBSV 091

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Transcript of the No-Bullsh!t Vegan podcast, episode 91

The K.I. team on "weight loss first" fitness, vegan and BMI BS-busting, our goals, & more

Karina Inkster:

Hey, welcome to the show. I'm Karina, your go-to no BS vegan fitness and nutrition coach. Today's episode is part-two with the KI team. We have both Zoe and Izzy here today. If you want to connect with them or check out the video version of our interview, head to our show notes at nobullshitvegan.com/091. So, let's get right into it. 


Introducing Zoe, she has been on our KI team as a coach since this past October, and she's also a behind the scenes ninja and creator of content shared with our social media audiences. Zoe is a marketing and community engagement professional and fitness coach based in Vancouver, BC. She received her BFA in photography from Emily Carr University, with additional studies in critical theory examining the positioning and terminology around animals. Her personal studies continue to examine animal/human relationships, which has led her to both speaking engagements and internationally published work.


Currently she sits on the board for PEACE, People Ensuring Animal Care Exists. She is a Vancouver March to Close All Slaughterhouses co-organizer. She facilitates events and community relations for numerous local vegan businesses. And she founded the Vancouver Vegan Resource Center, VVRC, in fall of 2018. Zoe has been vegan for 11 years and an animal rights activist for almost the same duration of time. Her athletic background spans a wide range of endeavors, including three professional boxing matches, half marathons, muay thai, multi-day endurance hiking, and distance swimming. Zoe is currently training for her first triathlon, a thousand-mile bike ride sometime in 2021, and eventually a competition related to her first and true love – weights, kettlebells, and strength training. So, when I asked Zoe what her favorite meal is, she said, “Well, last week it was crispy baked tofu made with a mountain of nootch, avocado toast, and all green vegetables.” But, this week it's anything that comes out of an air fryer. So, she may have just received an air fryer and has been experimenting with it. 


Now, Izzy, as you know from our last episode, is our communications head honcho. So she keeps the No-Bullshit Vegan Podcast running smoothly by scouting and booking guests for the show and prepping them for their interviews. And she also creates our show notes for our episodes. She shares with our online audience awesome vegan content every week, and also works behind the scenes to keep our coaching clients organized. Izzy has followed a plant-based diet for almost her entire life and began strength training in December 2014. In addition to working for the KI team, Izzy is a Main Street Vegan Academy Certified Master Vegan Lifestyle Coach and Educator, and works for Fraser Health as an executive assistant in her free time.


She plays the piano and fosters cats through Vancouver based cat rescue organization. VOKRA. Update though from our last discussion on our last podcast episode, she actually has a foster fail. So she and her partner officially adopted their last so-called foster that now is their long-term cat buddy. So congrats, Izzy and Carl that is super exciting. 

Izzy is also an assistant organizer of Vancouver Meatless Meetup. And she's the past director of Volunteers For Earth Save Canada. Originally from Bury, England, Izzy relocated to Canada in 2011 and lives in beautiful White Rock, BC with her vegan partner, Carl. Now also, as you know from our last episode, her favorite vegan meal is a delicious curry with a turmeric cumin and fresh ginger base with broccoli potatoes and zucchini over a bed of brown rice. 


Let's get to our discussion. Hey, Zoe and Izzie. Thanks so much for being on the show today.


Both:

Hey! 

Thanks for having us.


Karina Inkster:

I know we are now recording these on Zoom video, which we never used to do. It just used to be audio. So our listeners can now go and check out our group video if they're at all interested, which is kind of cool. Put a face to the name, you know.


Zoe Peled:

It's very cool. It's a multi multi-sensory option.  


Karina Inkster:

So, Izzy and I had a catch up about all the awesome things she's up to. So we've got an Izzy episode about being vegan and working in a hospital during the pandemic. And so there were a couple vegan related topics that came up. There was some cat fostering that we talked about naturally.


Zoe Peled:

Naturally, naturally, why not?


Karina Inkster:

But Zoe, I'd love to hear a quick update. You have recently joined the KI team as a coach, which has been fantastic. So I would love to hear what your experience has been and kind of how, how it's been going so far for you.


Zoe Peled:

Yeah, so I, I guess, let's say I officially joined in, in October as a coach because I, you know, we've, we've kind of worked together in the past in a few, in a few different capacities. In addition to the fact that you basically are responsible for developing my love affair with weightlifting and strength training. So, so yes, so that was, that was more so a little bit of marketing and social media in the past. And then in October, I came on board as a coach and it has been an absolutely tremendous experience over the past few months. I, I think that we just have an incredible bad-ass group of clients. We have, you know, a really wide variety of clients. They're very committed. They're very hardworking. And they're really dedicated. And it's, it's a challenging time for obvious reasons right now for a lot of, you know, for a lot of folks and to, to be part of this community where everyone has stayed, you know, consistently working hard and on track, that's, that's been a blast and it's honestly been well, it's been an honor. That's the word that I'm looking for.


Karina Inkster:

Well, I'm glad you think so. You know, there was a time last, not last year, the year before where Izzy took over everything for a week, which was actually the first week that I stepped away from my business completely. Like, you know, I've taken this odd - I always take Sundays off. Sundays are like, for sure, no work allowed. But you know, the drill with running your own business. There's always stuff to do anyway. So, I just like, the full week off for the first time in, at that point eight years. And so, Izzy just took over everything. I was in Hawaii at my best friend's wedding, and now we didn't have as many clients as we do now. Now it's a two person job for sure. But Izzy, I remember you were like doing check-ins with all our clients, taking care of all their workout updates. And I know it's been a while, but do you kind of remember what it was like when you did that while I was away?


Izzy Pope-Moore:

Yeah. I loved it. I thought it was super awesome. And just echoing what Zoe says as well. Like it it's just such dedicated clients. It's like, it just totally blew me away. Like people are so consistent with their workouts. And for those doing food logging, just so consistent with that as well. And it just was like, wow. Okay. It just, yeah, I really appreciated just, just to me as well, the effort that I put into my fitness as well. Cause I know I'm part of that client roster, so, you know, but just seeing other people be like, “Oh wow, this is what this person does.” And yeah, just totally awesome.


Karina Inkster:

Yeah. So, it's been, it's been really cool to have both of you ladies in different capacities, over different periods of time. I still feel like roping Izzy in at some point to do like full coaching because we, our client roster is growing. We talked a little bit about this in our, in our chat last week. I think it was. But with Izzy's certification with Main Street Vegan, I think there would be also that piece of like helping folks with the veganism transition piece. I think that would be really cool.


Zoe Peled:

Yeah. I just have a full-time job as well. Yeah. No, for me it's, it's just balance right now, but it definitely is on the cards. Let's put it that way. So yeah. 


Karina Inkster:

Exciting. We'll get her, very cool. Well, hey, so, it’s still the beginning of the year, we're recording this in January. And so we're, we have a couple of episodes about, you know, the whole bullshit busting around “New Year, New You,” that whole marketing shit storm.


So, I talked about that with Toby S who was on the show for a second time. He's awesome. And, but we were going to kind of discuss more the fitness professional side of things. Like I realized, there's a lot of coaches out there who are doing seriously legitimate work. Also some coaches out there not doing as much legitimate work. But Zoe, you brought to the table a couple ideas around how a lot of coaches, especially this time of year, are kind of milking the weight loss only approach to fitness. And you ladies are both examples of, okay, maybe that could be a side benefit if that's something that you want, but it's really not for us, anyway, the main focus. 


And we actually had a new client just recently who, in her application form, said, I chose your website, meaning our website of course, because it's not aesthetics forward or it's not like vanity metrics. She used the term vanity metrics. Vanity metrics centered, like, hey, we all want to look awesome. That's cool. But it's not really like the focus. And so, Izzy, for example, like you have had lots of experience with strength training, super long-term. You've had major surgery that you've recovered from where strength training, I would say, was actually something that almost prepared you for.


Izzy Pope-Moore:

Oh, hell yeah. 


Karina Inkster:

As weird as that might sound. So, maybe we can just kind of go into that, like weight loss at all costs or weight loss first approach. You know, like, let's throw it out there. What do you guys think?


Zoe Peled:

Yeah. Yeah. Well, I would, I would definitely say that this time of year especially, you see a lot of fitness professionals and coaches who are leading with that point. And you see a lot of verbiage, especially online and social media, where they start leading with that. You know, I'm, I'm talking early December. So, we're thinking of phrases like “Watch out the holidays are coming,” “You might fall off the metaphorical train.” So you best be getting yourself lined up for the new year, so you can redeem yourself from this great sin of eating more food over the holidays. And as you touched on, for some folks, if their primary goal is to lose weight, and they're doing that in a way, which is healthy and sustainable and well-informed, there's nothing bad about that. 


The dangerous piece comes in when you have fitness professionals framing the industry in a way which is saying the only reason you should be working out is weight loss. Whereas, in actuality, it's to get strong, it's to feel good, it's to feel badass, it's because you really want to do a 200 pound plus deadlift, and so many more reasons beyond weight loss.


Karina Inkster:

Absolutely well said, Zoe.


Zoe Peled:

Well, and again, I mean, I kind of just went on a a bit of an epic speech there, but it seems to be so pervasive. And I think that it's being called out in, in certain circles and it's being addressed. But the fact of the matter is, within the fitness and the athletic industries as a whole, it's still there. This piece about weight loss. This piece about, we only work out to lose weight. You know, these side conversations of tying our volume of working out in relation to what we eat and vice versa. Those are all very problematic trends.


Karina Inkster:

Absolutely. Yep. I think so the point is that there's nothing inherently wrong with wanting to lose weight or wanting a smaller body size. If that's something you want to work on, that's perfectly cool. But the issues arise when fitness professionals, especially, put weight loss, as, as you said, Zoe, the only reason to train. Or you frame it in a way where you're working out to make up for the food that you ate or you're working out because you're about to eat some treats or something. Where it's, it's directly tied to your fuel. But as you said, there's so many other ways or so many other reasons that I think are a little more empowering. I want to say like, okay, let, let's put Izzy in the spotlight for a second. Like, why do you strength train?


Izzy Pope-Moore:

I strength train because I want to be strong. That's it. And for me, I feel good. I feel good physically. I feel good mentally. Like, I know for me, I actually weighed more, like, I would say like a good, probably 15, maybe 20 pounds more than when I started with you. Like, okay, not all of that is muscle, you know, but I know that the bulk of that, like my shape, has drastically changed in six years and I am not smaller than I was. I was probably underweight when I started working out with you and now I'm healthy. And I'm like, you know what? Like, I like being at work, I'm on the unofficial gym committee. Because I literally live in the gym. But I'm like, you know what, like even my colleagues, they're going to, you know what? You inspire me to be healthier because you like, you inspire me to work out because you're so dedicated. And I'm like, I'm not there to lose weight. I'm there to keep strong, to keep healthy and just, you know, to make myself feel good, period. If I lose weight, great. If I don't lose weight, I honestly don't weigh myself anymore. Like, I don't know. The last time I logged my weight maybe about a year ago. Because I know for me, that's just not, it doesn't put me in a good mind frame at all. It just destroys my competence because it's like, Oh, I've gained like five pounds. I would have a crappy day now. And it's like, Nope, not going to do that. I just, I go to the gym consistently. I do my own thing. If my weight fluctuates, it fluctuates, but it's roughly the same. 


Karina Inkster:

Absolutely. You know, actually, Izzy, you have an interesting point, that even just by doing your own thing for yourself, for your own reasons, other people notice, and sometimes it's really obvious. Like, when they come up to you, like, your coworkers, and they're like, “Hey Izzy, you're inspiring,” which they do all the time, as they should. But then how many folks are out there who don't say anything to you and are still noticing these things like veganism, for example, working out regularly, whatever it is that people do that's kind of getting people thinking like, “Hmm, maybe I should model some of this.”


Izzy Pope-Moore:

Yeah. You know, like, the random person that starts talking to me, like, when I'm walking up the stairs, they'll come into the building because I took my own TRX to work and they’re like, what is that? And then I can get like into a whole, like what the TRX is. And they're like, Oh, that's so cool. And I'm like, you can do it at home. And yeah, just little things. For me, gym isn't about weight loss at all. It's just about, it's about being healthy well. 


Zoe Peled:

And you touched on it a little bit, but I think it's also always an added bonus in any situation, especially, you know, fitness and athletic realms, because we, we still see a lot of stereotypes around this. Anytime where we can be working to redefine some of the stereotypes around what, you know vegan and/or plant-based folks are capable of within an athletic realm. Anytime we can, we can kind of address those and challenge them and dismantle them, I think is an added bonus as well, which you're doing. 


Karina Inkster:

You're kind of reminding me of some of the, like, little pieces of bullshit that I have absorbed over the years. Like working in gyms back in the day, as you know, like we both, you know, both me and Zoe and me and Izzy have worked in a training capacity in gyms. And so that was my whole MO back then before I did the online thing. Literally just living in a gym, training clients. And so you get used to the gym talk and the bro atmosphere, depending on which gym you're working in, et cetera. But, you know, there were, there were things, I think I've mentioned on the show before, like, I really like chin-ups and pull-ups. They're my favorite exercise in the world. And so we used to have little like unofficial contests with other trainers at the gym, and I'd kick all their asses and they'd be like, “Oh, that's pretty good for a vegan,” thinking that they were funny. 


So, it's still like kind of inherent there, you know? And I remember a time I was at a commercial gym, which I haven't been in in years, but I was once, and there was an older lady who said like, “Why are you here? You don't need to lose any weight.” So, again, it was like the number one reason why you're there is to look a certain way. And then not only that, but once you've achieved it, you're done. Why do you need to continue going to the gym?


Zoe Peled:

Yeah. The vegan one is one of my, my favorite memories when I, so I participated in a boxing tournament called Aprons For Gloves, which is a fundraiser. And at the beginning, you need to, I don't want to say tryout, but you basically just need to go in and, and show that you have as a certain level of athletic capacity. And it's a known fact that when you do that, you know, when you're doing your minute on the bag and your minute in the ring, the coaches, the coaches will kind of razzle you a little bit, you know, poke fun and try and get a rise out of you to see how you respond. And I remember one coach who I knew before and he knew that I was vegan, and the whole time it was all these underhanded comments like, “Ah, okay, vegan. Oh, wow. We can really see those beans are fueling you really well.” And just throwing things like that left right and center. 


Lo and behold months later, I had the fight, which was my first fight, and I won. So, so I feel like it truly is one of the best things that we can do when those kind of comments are being hurled at us, as much as we want to respond and perhaps in an equal manner sometimes, the best thing that we can really do is continue, you know, to focus in whatever area that we are training and, and, and just kick ass and dazzle them with the outcome and prove them wrong with the outcome.


Karina Inkster:

A hundred percent. And you two are both living proof that that is possible. And that it's happening. You know, to me though, it's still kind of sad that we're at this point where we still have something to prove as vegans, as people who strength train, as women, perhaps who are vegan, who strength train, like just pile all the different concepts together.


So, it's you know, it's still important work though. And I think the industry as a whole, I don't know if you agree, but it's moving slowly in the right direction toward veganism. Toward some of this bullshit busting around females weightlifting, especially when it comes to, like Izzy mentioned, she's gained weight. I have too, I weigh 15 to 20 pounds more now than when I started strength training. So, like as a female who has been taught that the scale is your measure of kind of worth in a way, sad as that is, that’s just bullshit busting in real life basically. And there's, there's a lot to be done still. I think.


Zoe Peled:

Yeah, there's tons to be done. And we've, we've definitely been taught from a very early age that the scale is the Holy Grail. And we are not taught that, you know, that weight is a combination of fat mass and muscle mass. So sometimes your weight may not fluctuate, even though you're putting in an incredible amount of work and you've gained tons of muscle. We're just taught that if you look at this device and the number is not going down, you are doing something wrong. 


Karina Inkster:

I remember a progress photo of Izzy back in the day when we were working in person and she gained a bunch of muscle, bunch of strength, like, you know, she's increased all of the weights that she was using. It's pretty easy to measure that kind of stuff. You're either using 10 pounds or you're using 20 pounds. It's easy to track that progress. And so we had photos where, size wise, you know, like Izzy was wearing all the same clothes, no big difference in like pant size or anything like that. But she weighed 10 pounds more in the later, like so-called “after.” I'm using, after in quotes, cause it's never really after. But like in the after photo you had put on 10 pounds of muscle, but size wise, you were basically the same size, which happened to me as well. Like, my size didn't change. Certain areas maybe, but it's something that a lot of females still need to internalize, I think.


Izzy Pope-Moore:

Yeah. And I know like for myself, like when I started strength, I remember just sort of having like an internal conversation with myself that it was okay that my shape and that my weight was going to change, like that wasn't a bad thing. But I have to give myself like such a pep talk or a pep talk around that because the number on the scale, like I was like 120 something pounds and I'm like, I didn't eat well. Like I wasn't consistent, like with eating healthy, I just, you know, would restrict to everything. And I'm like, if I look back at that, I'm just like, “Oh my gosh.” 


Because I eat so much more now and I'm a bit bigger, but I'm not drastically, drastically bigger. You know? And it's like, it's okay that, you know, I don't weigh X, you know, that's okay. And if I eat, you know this whole like BMI thing, like if I went on that, I still, I'd be in the healthy-ish, you know, the healthy range. But I know that I'd be towards the top of that healthy range, but I know that I am stronger than the skinny person next to me that doesn't work out, that doesn't eat properly and I’m like [sighs]., But you know, technically, they’re healthier, and that is such bullshit. It really is. 


Karina Inkster:

BMI is huge bullshit. If our, if our listeners have not heard the three episodes that I did with Ren Jones, they should check those out immediately because he is also busting a lot of bullshit around like all these topics of scale weight, BMI, strength training, like all these things. He had a personal experience, which you can hear about in one of our episodes where he was at the doctor, just for like a regular physical I think, and the doctor was like, yeah, you should probably lose some weight because your BMI is like, you know, in the overweight category. And then Ren took his shirt off and he's like, the doctor said, oh no, you're good. Nevermind. Nevermind what I said, you're good. It's like, clearly there's a disconnect here between some random measure of body size and health. Like there's maybe on a population level, some kind of correlation, but it really shouldn't be used for individuals.


So, I think you guys are absolutely right. There's more bullshit busting we need to do, especially for women around all of these things. What are you two kind of thinking for the, for the coming year? Like, I know Zoe has possibly a crazy endurance event happening. Izzy has an awesome work gym available. So she's actually been going and lifting weights like during the entire pandemic, which is awesome. Most people have not had access. So Zoe let's, let's start with you. What is your training? I know that you've been doing some kettlebell stuff at home. What is the situations?


Zoe Peled:

Yes, yes. Okay. So I, I kind of have three, three areas of focus. I, I got a kettlebell, my own kettlebell for the first time, back in March when everything hit the fan, if you will. And I have really developed a deep, deep affinity for kettlebells over the past few months. I have spent the most time with my kettlebell, now kettlebells rather because I have more than one, you know, probably than I have with, with people for due reason. So I would love, I would love at some point, and granted, you know, this could only happen in different circumstances to move that towards some kind of strength competition with, with a kettlebell focus. But who knows when that will be? I was training for a triathlon last year, which was put on pause twice due to the pandemic. 


So right now, it's kind of an in-between mode of keep training, but we don't really know when the date will be, but keep training so that if the date is announced very soon, we'll kind of be ready. Which is an interesting place to be in, very weird. And, and then a big, big bike ride, which I cannot disclose a lot of details about, but I can say it is for a movie. And I can say, yeah, you're getting some top-secret info right now. And I can say that there will be an angle to it around vegan endurance and activism and anti-oppression and a few other very important subjects.


Karina Inkster:

Wow. Yeah. That sounds exciting. Dang. I have no exciting fitness or strength goals this year, way more VIP than anything I'm up to. What about you, Izzy? You mentioned like you bring your TRX to the gym, which is awesome. People maybe ask you like, what the hell is this thing? It probably lives, I assume your TRX lives in a drawer, right? Like at, at work. So are you focusing on anything?


Izzy Pope-Moore:

I've not really kind of decided yet. I know, but I can actually hang out yet the TRX up at home now. Cause we just moved house and I figured out one of those will actually take it. So I'm like, yes, I can use it at home. So if I have a week off, it means that I don't have to worry about the gym. So yeah, I don't know about focusing on anything specific. I think I just want to remain as consistent as I can going forward. Cause yeah, like it, it's just, it's just so important to me just to be able to go to the gym. Like if I can do three to four times a week, it's like totally awesome. So if I can carry on doing that. 


And a lot of that just depends on the state of really what's going on in the world because the work gym could close at any time, but we got really good measures in place and I'm hoping that it can stay open as long as possible. So yeah, just focusing on just keeping, going, getting as strong as I can get and maybe work on just upping a little bit on my bench press. I’m kind of at the 60 pound mark right now, but going from 60 to 70 is kind of, I don't know, that's a big push, so we'll see. We'll see.


Karina Inkster:

Yeah, I'm kind of in the same boat, Izzy. It’s like, I don't have a ton of exciting goals. Like I want to hit this number. I want to do this many reps. I'm doing an event. Like it's kind of, make sure I don't fuck up my back, swim twice a week, and continue my strength training. Like, it's not super exciting, but I feel like because I am strength training for non-aesthetic reasons, with aesthetic reasons being kind of a default benefit. That's cool. Like that keeps me going right. Like function. I have chronic low back issues. So just keeping that, you know, at bay, if you will, Just keeping myself functional, feeling good, making sure I do my swimming cause that's great for my back and I really love it. So, it's something to kind of enjoy other than lifting, which is kind of what I'm obsessed with most.


So yeah, I think I could go either way. Maybe next year I'll have something more like Zoe where there's like, ok, I've got a focus and there's possibly an event. That's cool too. I've done that. And it's super exciting and it's almost like its own motivator when you have these reasons to train, you know, that are extraneous, that are exciting. But sometimes it's just about doing your thing and being consistent and checking it off the list and looking at your whole year of workouts and being like, yeah, it looks pretty legit. Let's do another year.


Zoe Peled:

Well, I'm glad we all shared those because I also think it's important. You know, when we talk about addressing some of the, the bullshit within the industry, I think it's important to address that there is diversity in goals. And just, just because you may not be working towards a particular number or a particular, you know, event or incident does not, does not mean that those other goals are not just as valid and important.


Karina Inkster:

Absolutely. Yep. Do you guys ever come across like in the fitness vegan world, you know, on social media – Izzy is our social media person. So she finds all of the content for our Facebook page and Zoe is like, you've got three times as many followers as I do. So you're like clearly killing it and social media.


Izzy Pope-Moore:

I do some things on Instagram once in a while.


Karina Inkster:

You're on there. Have you guys come across anything that stands out in the vegan world where you're like, yeah, that's not a great approach either to veganism or fitness? Something that you've come across where it's like I'm not sure this is actually helpful for folks to put out?


Zoe Peled:

Where, where can I begin? Two things, two things come to mind that have been quite prevalent recently. One of which I believe you've talked about before with, with guests, and that is the notion of veganism being used exclusively as a weight loss prompt or tool. So, you know, you know, in certain circles by certain individuals, of course. But the fact that veganism is used as a marketing, you know, a piece of marketing, and indicated that one should be considering veganism for the sole purpose of weight loss and completely dismissing and failing to mention the, the very important, you know, historical and ethical context of, of what veganism is.


Karina Inkster:

That's a good one. Yeah, absolutely. I think Raydel Hernandez who was on the show had a really good little bit about that. Like yeah, people are inherently self-involved and they inherently want good health for themselves, whether that means weight loss or not, but you can't really leave those pieces out when it comes to veganism. I don't think.


Zoe Peled:

Yeah. So I think that that has been ruminating for a while. And another one that, and this is not new. I would say this has kind of been a conversation within, within the community, both in-person and online for quite a while, is as long-term vegans, you know, what is our official stance? Because of course you need, you can have an official stance as one giant group of diverse humans. What is, you know, what is our collective official stance on someone who says, “I don't think I'm ready to be vegan yet. I, I could be vegetarian though,” or someone who says, “I can't really do vegetarian, but I could do meatless Monday.” And, and the response from a lot of vegans is no, you, you need to either become vegan or you are not contributing. You are not doing any good. And I, I think that the nuance and the really interesting thing that hasn't been explored is acknowledging that you can kind of do two things at once. And that is that you can, you know, support someone's decision and acknowledg that there is benefit in becoming vegetarian and simultaneously acknowledge that if a person is doing that because they want to help and save animals, the environment and better their health, ultimately the best way they can do that is to be vegan.


Karina Inkster:

A hundred percent. It's kind of like tackling one aspect of fitness or weight loss, if that's something somebody wants to work on, right? You're not going to say, okay, dude, we're going to do a 180 on your diet. You're going to start training six days a week. You're going to have a marathon on the calendar for four weeks from now. You're going to start getting up at 5:00 AM every day, like at, at once, all simultaneously, right? Not that you have to do any of those things to be a fit healthy person. I'm just using them as an example. But yeah, don't you see it’s a little, or wouldn't you kind of see it as a little bit of a parallel towards like, if someone came to you saying, “Hey, I want to work on my fitness. I'm going to start by walking 10 minutes a day”? You wouldn't just be like, dude, that's a dumb idea. You need to go to the gym five days a week to get there.


Zoe Peled:

Exactly. Exactly. Yeah. But it comes down to this and, and again, this has come up on a few podcasts before. It comes down to this notion of absolutism and this notion of, you know, you are only, you can only be deemed a good vegan if you do this. And if you've been doing it for this long. And, and that's so backwards because maybe one or two or more folks are going to have a positive response to that kind of messaging. But the reality is the majority is not so true.


Karina Inkster:

So true. So, like, when Izzy mentioned just kind of doing her thing and people noticing, how much impact is that having? Someone might see Izzy bring her TRX to the gym and be like, Ooh, that looks cool. And then when they see one on Amazon, you know, three months down the road, they'll be like, “Hey, maybe I'll use this for my own fitness.” Or if they see Izzy's amazing lunch that she brings to work, let's say, and they're like, “Oh yeah, she's vegan. That's cool. Maybe I'll try a vegan lunch next week.” It's it all moves in that direction. Doesn't it?


Zoe Peled:

Yes. And we, and we never know. I mean, with the examples that you just referenced with, you know, folks who might see us in the grocery store buying a certain product and not say anything, but be curious about it, oor the folks who see content that we're putting on social media, but may not engage with it in any capacity. All of that, you know, all of that has incredible potential and we don't always know how much reach something will have. And that's a really, that's a really unique position to be in. And it's a position that has a lot of growth potential as well, which is only positive.


Karina Inkster:

Absolutely. Izzy, I'm curious, is this whole concept something that Victoria or anyone else in the Main Street Vegan talk about? Like, the question, just curious, I mean, does it really come up in like how veganism itself is presented?


Izzy Pope-Moore:

I think a little bit, I don't think we went into like super, super, super detail on that, but I do remember just talking little bit about it, you know, like an all or nothing approach isn't really, it's not really beneficial. It really isn't. Like, in my mind, that's why a lot of people just have these stereotypes, like stereotypical view of vegans, like crazy vegan. Because everything has to be perfect. Well, it's not always perfect, you know, it's it isn't so, all you can do is just do the best that you can do. And if somebody decides to say, be vegetarian, instead of eating meat, for me, that's like, it's something, you know, it's definitely something. Is it as ideal as I personally would like it? No, but I'm not that person. as long as they’re elevating their truths and they’re comfortable with that? Fine, fine.


Karina Inkster:

So, Izzy, the work that you want to get into with, like, helping folks in a kind of coaching sense around veganism? I would assume that that's mostly folks who have already made the decision that they want to go plant-based and you help with it, right?


Izzy Pope-Moore:

Yeah, yeah, yeah. All people who are curious and like, “Oh, I don't quite know how to do this,” rather than someone like, “Well, I'm not like, you know, maybe I'll try it,” kind of thing. It's like, no, you're going to have to, you know, you're going to have to be committed to this because it is a path and it is a process and it's a lot of change, you know? For me, I didn't find vegan going vegan that difficult because I was vegetarian beforehand. I think that is actually a really good foundation because you kind of know already some of the things that you can swap out or that you can do, you know, and just the availability of products these days makes it so much easier to be like, “Oh, let's just try this yogurt.” You know, that kind of thing.


But I think going completely from one to the other, like my partner Carl, he became vegan overnight basically before he met me. And I just like, I look at that and I'm like, how the heck did you, like, how did you do that? Cause it's so much change. It's basically changing everything that, you know, around food and not just food, but lifestyle as well. And I know for him, a lot of the lifestyle things came later. And so say like, you know, like buying like vegan belts and vegan shoes and things like, they were kind of the things later on, but he started to do it. But like, it's a huge shift. So everyone's got to do that in their own way. And like, I know vegetarians that, okay, they still have dairy and stuff like that. But like other things that they have in their lives, they’re vegan.


You know, they're not even eating vegetarian everyday. Sometimes they're eating vegan, sometimes they're using vegan products and that kind of thing. And then I know some vegans that don't actually use, like animal friendly, like shampoo and things like that. And I'm like, Oh, okay. Like, you know, that's one thing when I went vegan that I did have to switch out like all of my beauty products, you know, and that was like, whoa, like god knows how many types of conditioner. I tried to get it to work with me, you know? But that's like something with the coaching that I can help with as well, you know, like, because I know like, okay, these are all like, you can go to London Drugs and pick stuff up. And it's like, wow, that's super awesome. And a lot of people don't even know that.


Karina Inkster:

I heard that London Drugs, which, for our listeners I think is exclusively Canadian. They have an entire aisle dedicated to Veganuary, which is so cool. And I remember I used to live next to a London Drugs. We actually sadly don't have a London Drugs in Powell River, unfortunately, but they had surprisingly large selections of vegan items like vegan jerky. They had like all sorts of vegan snacks, very vegan-friendly, and they have a line of vegan cosmetics, which I like. And it's kind of a surprise. Like it's not billed as, like, the “vegan store” by any means. But things like that where the average newbie vegan might not know that London Drugs, for example, is a vegan-friendly place. That's the kind of stuff that long-term folks like us, and especially Izzy in the coaching realm, could work on. 


Because Zoe and I are like, yeah, sure. We can give clients ideas and we can brainstorm. We can give them suggestions. But we're not like hands-on working with them on the lifestyle, like cosmetics or household products, you know. Like, we're really focusing on the strength training and the nutrition around strength training. So I think that would kind of be a cool additional piece to bring in, just like a shopping trip to London drugs. 


Zoe Peled:

But it's, it's really cool. And I'd say, you know, acknowledging London drugs and the fact that they're doing the Veganuary aisle. And also acknowledging the fact that we've seen places like Great Canadian Superstore, who have developed entire, you know, plant-based lines. And yes, it's safe to assume they are doing that because they see the opportunity. Not necessarily because they've had a, you know, a company-wide ethical shift. But the end result there is the fact that more plant-based and vegan products are getting into more grocery stores and becoming more accessible to a wider range of shoppers on a wide range of budgets. And that's imperative. 


Karina Inkster:

Yeah. I also miss Superstore. We used to have one of those. We used to go there every week. When we do though, we have to take a 90 minute ferry over to the Island and then we have to go to Superstore and stock up on like everything. We usually buy them out of like tofu puffs and all the things that we find a little harder to get. And we just like stock our giant deep freeze full of like six months worth of products that we can't get here.  We may or may not have two 10 pound boxes of frozen Beyond patties in our freezer right now. There's literally 20 pounds of Beyond Meat in our freezer. I mean, we're not eating that every week.


Zoe Peled:

Yeah. I was going to say, when the, I always mix the brands up, maybe the Soyganic sSmoked Tofu became available again, there was some mass purchasing happening. Many, many packages. 


Karina Inkster:

That was a pandemic thing. It was like toilet paper, hand sanitizer, and smoked tofu.


Zoe Peled:

It was amazing, because when it finally resurfaced again, I'm not sure where it was first, you know, you saw every single vegan group and everyone posting on social media that, that the smoked tofu was back. And here's where it is. Here's the aisle, get to it as fast as possible. Very important. It is hilarious.


Karina Inkster:

Well, let's leave it there. I know that we could do a whole other episode on, like, vegan finds and where to go to find awesome vegan food, which maybe we should do at some point. It's just hard to do with listeners from all over, but maybe we could do something, you know, maybe a resource around that or something. Yeah. Anyway, so Zoe and Izzy, it was great speaking with you. Thank you so much for coming on the show. I think it's going to be great actually for our listeners to get a little behind the scenes of like the KI team, all in one. I was going to say room, but I guess it's a Zoom room all in one virtual space at the same time, which never happens by the way. It's usually like two of us, not three of us all at once. So that's kind of cool. So yeah. Thank you so much for coming on. We're going to have show notes where you can connect with Izzy and Zoe. And thanks again for speaking with me today. I am so lucky I get to work with you. You two are amazing. And thank you again for this super fun podcast discussion. We should definitely do that again sometime. Access our show notes at nobullshitvegan.com/091. And thank you so much for tuning in.




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